Read this question on another blog and I had to bring it to Flagler for feeedback.


With the perception from women that men are afraid to commit but yet men are quick to offer gifts and cash for a womans attention over the next man..are men taking shortcuts by trying to buy the attenion from women instead of properly courting a woman (even if a woman has her own)?

 Are men using gifts, shopping sprees, trips to salons as a way to expeditiously get sex and companionship in return from a woman?

Are women buying into what they should receive in return buy expecting a man to come out of his pockets since so many other men are offering gifts or money?

Who's pimpin who?

 

Are men using gifts, shopping sprees, trips to salons as a way to expeditiously get sex and companionship in return from a woman?

Yeap!  Like I've said before....Golddiggers are MADE not BORN.


Are women buying into what they should receive in return buy expecting a man to come out of his pockets since so many other men are offering gifts or money?

Yeap!  Again...Golddigers are MADE not BORN.


Who's pimpin who?

They're pimping each other....sad, but true.

@Mass:  Felt like I needed to expound on my response a lil bit.  I was a bit scarcastic because I have some male friends that cry in their beer about the women that "use" them, when they were the ones trying to outbid the competition via material goods or money instead of putting in the mental work. 

And I have female friends who feel that their beauty entitles them to fleece a man's pockets. 

One of my girls would not even go out with this guy until he bought her a pair of True Religion jeans, and got her nails & feet done for her date with him.  When I tried to talk to her about the foulness of that...her response, was "Look @ Me!  That Mudda Fucca gotta pay if he want somebody like me on his arm!" 

So yeah, I'm a bit jaded about the whole idea of men spending money on a woman in order to get first place in line (and trust its usually a line); and  the expectation that some women have of being "taken care of" before they will give of their time. 

I thk men&women tryen to get one UP! on each other dat way if it don't wrk either could say well at lease i got something out deal with out comen off anythg valuable or losing some kinda pride are what not so see men weren't born to say I INVENTED SEX and woman weren't born GOLD DIGGERS period..... How'ev we so busy tryen to get over on the other we don't notice the benefit that lay before us@peace.

Cosign w// Dashon.  I think every woman has had the experience of ebing "down" for a brother, not pressing him about spending money, only to have him turn around and buy the world for the next chick.

 Yes, I've seen this "buying" behavior a lot. But I see more females "buying" the guys. Not -- the males so much. I know a female, who pays all the bills, buy beer and clothes, and bought this guy a car. He does nothing. Nothing at all. But she gives him everything. But she does nothing for her kids.

I do know of a few women who demand things up front to accompany a man. One likes her nails and hair done, the other a light bill or a car payment. 

I see it as a form of prostitution, they just are not standing on the corner. some men use their money to get and  try keep a woman's attention. But, they (the guys) are really selling themselves short. Because at the end of the day, they should wonder if the lady  really wants them or just the money.

@Tru:  Yeah, I've seen that too.  I don't mind sharing the expenses of dating...but "buying" a dude or taking care of a grown man is not my thing.  SMH@ the chick that takes care of guy over her kids....now that's trifling.

@Mass: I definitely think that women and men are bartering or "pimping" each other in the dating game these days! It seems like it is mostly about the bartering instead of actually attempting to meet someone for the purpose of actually "clicking"! I think it is sad that it is costing people so much: both financially and emotionally. If you ask me, it is the Pyschology of Pimpin' gone ALL THE WAY WRONG!!!

Dashon, I with your sista friend in beating some sucker out of his loot.  I've heard stories of men like that from the sistas, but non of my boys have ever been the type. 

I know this one old school player (65) who was dating my girl's younger sister (34), and she played the sh.t out of him... and I don't blame her one bit.  This old fool was pissed off when he got dumped by her when she found another sucker to "keep" it. She went from one sucker straight to another sucker, and I don't blame her, because...

there is one born every minute.

Mass:  No, I don't think it is a short cut at all.  Personally, I'm glad many sistas are like that, because it made things a lot easier for me.  I've come across quite a few of these sistas; although, the physical attraction may be there, it is apparent that we are two totally different people with very little in common on a deeper level.

Each party is an eager participant to the game, but when out there in the "field", you will have any given party getting their ass bit and played while in the game and calling foul... that is just the cost of doing business.

Personally, I think this work against the sistas more so than the men.  The brothas have no issue with taking their lumps and continuing, but the sistas will see her "stock" declining and will want to leave the game and try to settle down, but there is another "group" of player eagerly waiting with the "nice guy" persona to start the game all over again...and breaking hearts.

I have a close fine and sexy sista friend who has this "a gentleman will not let a lady pay for anything" position.  Since I have a "lady will have to be a lady and come out her pockets" position, it was apparent after the first date, that we enjoyed each other's company, great conversation, etc, but that was as far as it could go with us...

I ain't spending, and she ain't spending.

Hell No! -lol We must have some cheap men around here cause no body up North is splurging. I'm not a gold digger, but if we are dating I expect a man to come out of pocket if he asks me out. If I ask you out, I will come out of pocket...Read Below and give me your opinion.

 I had a conversation with one of the men I've been dating and he actually asked that we start going dutch - lol. It seems the last time we went out he didn't want to use his card at the bar...said he'd be required to open up a tab. I told him to tell them he didn't want to open up a tab. So he paid (I let him choose a drink for me- my max is 1...I'm not a drinker).

You see he wanted to know if I'd be open to buying US drinks--and honestly he asked me out...so I told him I didn't have any cash on me-lol. (Permitted - we have been friends for years and have dated for several months AND this was NOT our first date).

Well, later on that night we went to a place that was overcrowded-after 2am spot...he asked me if I had $2 for a slice of pizza...so I pulled out a fairly large bill and bought him 1 slice. I know, I shoulda acted like I still didn't have any money...Well this is how the whole, Can we go dutch conversation came up. My thing is....if we go dutch, you are now putting yourself in the "friend" category (no, I didn't tell him this). I told him we didn't need to have this discussion, he shouldn't of offered to buy me a drink and it would've been cool.

If a man is going to take me out, I like him to spend on me (not splurge, but you're covering the date). Otherwise, what's the point? I'm contemplating on NOT going out with this cat anymore because of the whole dutch thing. Am I wrong for feeling this way? I know he felt I was selfish for not buying drinks when I had money on me, BUT he was the one who asked me out for drinks. Do ya'll see his point?

My thing is IF you don't want to spend, take me somewhere where you don't HAVE to spend...don't act a certain way and then try to change up after a couple of months. If you gonna be a certain way, you have to act that way from the beginning--you CAN'T change it up fellas...I can learn from this one too. I shoulda acted like I didn't have $2!

@Perpetual

If you all have been dating for a few months why are you two still keeping track who's buying what and how much? By now you two should be a team and just worrying about having a good time with each other rather than keeping tabs on a $2 slice or saying you don't have money when you really do. What happened with keeping it 100? Who cares who asked who out..just go out, kick it and enjoy each others company. It all equals out in the end one anyway or another is how I look at it rather if its monetary or not.

What's wrong with going dutch..that man works just as hard and probably has as many bills so why not take some burden off him by meeting him half way. If he's not worth you spending a few dollars on then he might want to throw those deuces up for real.

@Mass- LOL. I know. I wasn't keeping tabs on anything, but I felt like he was when he brought this up. I told him, we didn't even need to have a discussion about it...just let me do me when we are out--don't offer to buy me anything. I bought him a slice of pizza, but MASS I am not used to asking a man if he wants a drink and what not. I've made him dinner on several occasions to make up for him taking me out, and I've bought him gifts on his birthday...so I don't see why it is an issue worth discussing. My thing is if you are going to do it, DO it! If not, then don't. I am NOT a gold digger. I look out for him too.

@Perpetual

You know I like to paraphrase so I don't misquote anyone and sometimes people need to reread some things they that write to get a better understanding of what they say.


"...just let me do me when we are out--don't offer to buy me anything.
That sounds like your acting to independent

" I bought him a slice of pizza, but MASS I am not used to asking a man if he wants a drink and what not."
Wouldn't you thinnk asking  man for a drink would make a perfectly nice gesture? Is it the money or the fear of looking too agressive?

 "I've made him dinner on several occasions to make up for him taking me out, and I've bought him gifts on his birthday..."

So is the only a give and take type situation and should you be rewarded by buying him a gift for his birthday or cooking dinner?


"so I don't see why it is an issue worth discussing"

Apparently there needs to be more communication if you two can't agree on a $2 slice of pizza and you've been dating for a few months.

Well Perpetual,  as a man, I can see and relate to his position.  Hell, I mean, you are always up here talking about not coughing up no ass to a nugga, so I can see his position.  I don't know whether you coughed up any to him or not, but I can bet you haven't.  He may be cash strapped, or he is doing what many brothas have done... just keeping his cash close to him, especially when you feel that a sista is wanting to spend some time, but ain't coughin up no ass.

Cough it up...lol.

Sometimes, the Brotha-hood will see a sista on what many calls, their "spare" time.  Meaning he isn't really looking to get too serious with her, but he still want to see her, but keep his exposure, i,e. money spent to a minimum.

Oh oh, I forgot to be more sensitive... replace "cough" and "ass" with Make love...

how is that for the new D.Wood...lol.

@Perpetual: Girl I'm with you, ain't no man on the Northeast splurging... They're rarely even a little romantic up this way nowadays.

@All: I agree both men & women are pimping each other... Well some are. For those who aren't, we get second hand treatment with littler or no real effort of 'woo'ing' or courting. Hmmm courting, what's that... Every dude I have met up here are fairly boring & think bringing a sista out for food is grandeur. Puh-llllzzzzz, I'm pretty simple so little thoughtful expressions go a longer way. But hey dudes are used to some ladies taking them for all they got or for the tangible so they go into dating expecting that from all women. Oh well...

@Mass: You're right and I felt bad when he addressed his reasoning behind wanting to go dutch. I asked him if he felt like I was a gold digger --and he told me he felt I was CHEAP-lol. However, I feel like my way of being generous is different...when I cook for him..that is me showing him my appreciation for having him in my life (I like being around him). But I did this when we were JUST friends too--- and I do this now that we are dating...but I feel he wants to change up b/c we ARE dating and going out more. Should I change up to? Does that make sense?

@Wood: He was actually my first--so we've taken it there before...haven't been there sense. I have to feel him out from a dating perspective; it's been a couple of years and we were friends then. So...I don't know if I'm going to cough it up yet. He dropped this bomb on me -lol (joking)..let's see what other bombs he'll be dropping (you men speak through your actions). I won't be taking it there until we actually solidify a relationship and get past our friendship. Sometimes when you've been friends for a while, it's hard to take it past that level..

@ Dashon

I physically SEE what you posted about in the first two replies happening in real life....although I'm not a man that does such things for any woman.

I always thought that the mental courtship was supposed to come first and then, if things go properly, I might be compelled to upgrade to McDonald's for her. (Laughs)

(That was a joke.....before anyone comes at me calling me a cheapskate or whatever. LOL)

But you know where I am in the dating world....My philosophy is correct, my ways are mature, and now I have some of the confidence necessary to execute.....but as always, I have no woman to work with.

@ MsValleyG

So does splurging equate to being romantic?

LOL @ Intro: NO slurging does not equate to being romantic. Did you read my whole statement... I said men on the northeast don't splurge and they're rarely romantic. I also indicated that little thoughtful expressions go a longer way (with me). Therefore for me, splurging DOES NOT equate being romantic. I was just saying that men up this way (the one's I've met) don't SPLURGE as this blog infers to women wanting material things from men... some women. Also, they're not very romantic up this way either.

@Intro: No. Splurging is a term we use for pampering a female and overspending..this is what a gold digger looks for (milking a man for bills, hair, nails, etc.) 

@ MsValleyG

Just checking. You used those two nonrelated clauses in the same sentence like they had some correlation, so I asked just to be sure.

(Kind of like how women love using the two nonrelated clauses "I can pay my own bills and I'm independent" and "I don't need no man to take care of me"-----And that has a logically thinking man like myself wondering if that is all women think men are good for, you feel me?)

Kind of went off on a slight tangent there, but I'm Intro....that's what I do. LOL. Let me stop before I start something this Wednesday morning.

@Intro: You can't bulk all women into a general category or with general attribute, characters. Every woman is unique in her own way. Every woman is not going to be for you & every woman is not going to have the same feelings you do.

@Perpetual: Perhaps it's the difference in location causing the mix up with Intro. I dunno. LOL!

@ MsV

I try not to do that. Seriously. LOL

I also try not to let the fact that most women I have been coming across lately don't even seem to like or trust men cloud my opinion of y'all.

R.I.P. Guru of Gangstarr..a.k.a Mass' FH namesake.  That was a talented brother

@Wood: Sometimes, the Brotha-hood will see a sista on what many calls, their "spare" time.  Meaning he isn't really looking to get too serious with her, but he still want to see her, but keep his exposure, i,e. money spent to a minimum.

Didn't see this comment yesterday...Thank you for your honesty. You hit the nail on the head Wood and that's how I felt when he addressed the whole going dutch idea. I don't have time for that...friendship is fine with me